Loki Episode 5 Journey Into Mystery

MarvelVision: Loki, Episode 5 – “Journey Into Mystery”

MarvelVision podcasts

Loki is trapped in The Void and it’s up to Sylvie — and a host of other Lokis — to save him on this Easter egg packed episode, “Journey Into Mystery.” After getting pruned by the TVA, Loki teams up with Kid Loki, Classic Loki, Boastful Loki and Alligator Loki to try and escape villainous cloud Alioth. Meanwhile, Sylvie teams up with Ravonna Renslayer, though the alliance is short lived. And a climactic battle helps set up the season finale… From the Thanos-copter, to Frog Thor, to all the references to Kang (and Dr. Doom??) we break it all down.

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Full Episode Transcript

Alex:                 Welcome to MarvelVision, a podcast about Marvel, the MCU and Loki. I’m, Alex.

Pete:                I’m Pete.

Alex:                 We are going to be talking about episode five of season one of Loki: Journey Into Mystery. You’ve got to watch it. What?

Pete:                That means something right there.

Alex:                 It means, listen, we’re going to get into this. I got to give the spoiler warning here because there are so many things going out of this episode. This had more Easter eggs than the White House lawn the Sunday of Easter. That’s what I’m talking about here. We’re going to get into all of that stuff, and I definitely want to talk about this episode because obviously this is a huge one. This is the pen ultimate episode of the first season of Loki, but first, Pete, you weren’t here last week. We got into one of your wheelhouses a little bit. There was a lot of controversy, a lot of debate about it online, and we even talked about it here on the podcast. Justin and I had discussed it, but there seemed to be something going on with Sylvie and Loki.

Pete:                Yeah.

Alex:                 That builds more in this episode. Before we get into the specifics of what happened this week, how are you feeling about this as our romcom expert?

Pete:                First off, I love awkward romcom moments, and this was just killing it on that. It’s also a little weird if you stop and thinking about it because it’s like is Loki in love with himself? What is happening with that, but I think they are absolutely adorable together. Some real moments in this episode that I clutched my pearls. It’s very exciting. I love the turn that this show is taking. Man, they just really keep you on your toes, so many crazy things all happening at once. This is just a lot of fun. I’m at first I was kind of like, what is the show? What is happening? There’s so many things. It’s slow and fast and all over the place, but this hits a rhythm that everything comes together in all the right ways. I’m having such a blast.

Alex:                 Broad overview of this episode, even though, again, I’m sure you watched it, but in case people that listened to the podcast later, centuries from now when they revisit our Loki podcast. Loki has been pruned from the timeline, except it turns out when you’re pruned, you’re not actually killed. You are sent to the void at the end of time, which is where things get destroyed and eaten as “the timekeepers” figure out what’s going to happen at the end of the time and that always progress. Loki very quickly figures out, thanks to classic Loki, boastful Loki, kid Loki, and alligator Loki.

Pete:                Alligator Loki.

Alex:                 I appreciate them specifying that it was an alligator and not a crocodile because I called him alligator Loki. My daughter corrected me and said, “No, no, that’s definitely a crocodile,” but I was right and I’m going to rub it in her face.

Pete:                You should, you should. That’s how parenting works.

Alex:                 They got to learn sometime, the difference between alligators and crocodiles. He encounters all of them. They’ve become pretty cool about living in this wasteland void and almost being eaten by a giant cloud named Alioff, Alioth, excuse me.

Pete:                Just your normal day.

Alex:                 Yes.

Pete:                You think your day is bad.

Alex:                 Sylvie comes to the rescue. Sylvie proves herself, after Ravonna Renslayer of all people betrays her, jumps to the void teams up with the Lokis, just realizes that she can enchant Alioth with, and that’s the plan that they come up with. Ultimately, classic Loki sacrifices himself in a really wonderful way. I love that moment so much. Loki, our Loki, and Sylvie disperse Alioth and head towards something, presumably whoever is actually behind the TVA. Also, thanks to Mobius, who is heading back to the TVA, is alive himself, and is going to burn the whole thing to the ground.

Pete:                Burn it down.

Alex:                 Burn the whole thing to the ground. Meanwhile, Ravonna is doing some research of her own to try to figure out what’s going on with TVA. Maybe she knows, maybe she doesn’t, but you certainly set miss minutes on a task to find out what’s actually going on. Lots of stuff set up here, but I do want to jump off something that you just said, Pete. We’ve talked about this, we’ve mentioned this on the podcast a couple of times. Michael Waldron was pretty upfront about the series and said, “Like Loki, I want to shake it up every episode. Every episode is going to kind of be its own thing while flowing the plot.” I think, first of all, they’ve been doing a great job of that, of making an episodic television, but also just driving down on the theme of lying and friendship and using these two parts of things.

Pete:                Betrayal.

Alex:                 Betrayal and all of these things that make Loki Loki, or Loki’s Lokis, and hitting them so hard at every episode. It’s so smart. We’ll see how it all ties up. People put a lot of pressure on last episodes but just based on these first five, this series has been great. I’ve loved it.

Pete:                I really think they’ve done a great job of building along the season. What’s also great is the Marvel shows are so different. Wanda Vision was different from Winter Soldier and Cap. This is its own thing and so clever the way things are all coming together. I cannot wait to get into all the different, fun things in this episode, but there were just so many times where I paused it just to soak it in because I was having so much fun. Not to rewatch something, just to kind of enjoy the moment of what’s happening. Oh, this was my favorite episode by far.

Alex:                 Really?

Pete:                Cannot wait for the last episode. Man, this was so much fun.

Alex:                 Why was this your favorite episode? Was it because of all the Easter eggs? Was it because of the Sylvie Loki stuff? What drew you to this one in particular?

Pete:                People talk about Loki being Loki. The moment where we are with the Loki alligator and there’s old Loki or original Loki and then different Lokis, and then he opens up the thing and an army of Lokis comes down and then it’s just a domino effect of betrayal. Oh my God. It was just so fun and such a callback to Thor kind of playing with Loki, being like you’re so predictable. Then this thing of like hey, it’s never too late to change that Owen Wilson talks about. Then Loki really does. Oh, I am so excited. If he betrays Sylvie, I will lose my goddamned mind because it’s so nice between them right now. It’s so much fun.

Alex:                 It is great, but one of my favorite exchanges in the episode, you have that whole beautiful, really nicely played scene between Sylvia and Loki when they’re sitting outside the barbershop where the rest of the Lokis are hanging out with Mobius, and they’re talking and they’re doing the whole thing with the cape and the cute little snuggle thing and everything. I don’t remember the exact line. I should have written it down, but Sylvia asks Loki, will you betray me? He gives this look like well, I’m Loki, and then he gives that little speech about I betrayed Thor, I betrayed my brother, my father, my mother, Asgard, absolutely everybody. He doesn’t say no, I’m not going to portray you because he knows it’s in his essential nature to always be playing the long game, always be the claim of con game. The only one who seems to have broken that cycle in any way is classic Loki, the old Loki, but even he reached a point where he was like no, I have to show everybody that I’m still alive. That I made it out. I don’t think he says that.

Pete:                Glorious purpose, man.

Alex:                 Exactly.

Pete:                Glorious purpose.

Alex:                 Glorious purpose, but betrayal has to be part of that. Well, I was thinking about this a little bit.

Pete:                Don’t you fucking ruin this for me. Don’t you ruin this for me.

Alex:                 No, I was thinking about this during the episode that I think what they’re playing here is really smart that we’re not getting a heroic Loki here at the end of the series. He’s still always going to be an antihero. He’s still always going to be Loki. Do you want to see a Loki who is good and pure and happy with his friends and has learned all of his lessons and completed [crosstalk 00:08:48]?

Pete:                I don’t know. It’s a Loki we haven’t seen it yet.

Alex:                 Sacrifices himself?

Pete:                Yeah. Don’t put Loki in a little box there. He could grow beyond his stature. It could be a whole new Loki. He could be mischievous in different times but if he’s true to Sylvie, I don’t know. Why can’t he rise above what’s happening? He does. He sacrifices himself for the mission at the end of this episode in such a glorious way, and then gets one upped by classic Loki and it’s awesome to see.

Alex:                 The thing that they are doing here, to the point that you’re making, is they are growing Loki. They are allowing him to have a character arc, but there are things that essentially make Loki Loki. We don’t need him to turn into Captain America where he’s doing the sacrifice play at every turn.

Pete:                Why would he?

Alex:                 I guess what I’m saying, and this is getting into predictions for the last episode, but if we get a resolution where Loki throws himself into a portal and saves the day, that’s not Loki. It needs to be a twist in some way, a twist of the knife, where he is betraying somebody, where he is doing that, but he’s doing it for the greater good.

Pete:                No. No. Have you not been paying attention. Yeah. He is a different Loki. He’s the one Loki that can save the day and can do this. I don’t know who’s going to betray who at the end, and I don’t want to think about it because I’m enjoying where we are. The fact that right now Loki is trying to grow and be better is awesome.

Alex:                 Well, I’ll throw this out.

Pete:                I don’t care if it fights his nature or whatever bullshit you want to put on him. This is a different Loki and he has maybe love or something, and I think it could be enough to change him. His speech, where even though all of his Lokis laugh at him was awesome and very moving.

Alex:                 I agree with you, but a bigger question I have off of this episode, they really drive home that maybe he is not the special Loki. Sylvia is the special Loki. She’s the different one. She’s the powerful one who can do the things the rest of them can’t. I think, if anything, maybe this is what I want to see versus what I think will actually happen or no will actually happen, but I think Sylvia is the one who needs to grow and change. She needs to trust people. She needs to become the better Loki, “our Loki” or whatever you want to call it, Avengers End Game Loki. Maybe he doesn’t have to change. Maybe he only needs to change a little bit. He needs to change 10%, while Sylvia is the one that needs to change 80%, 90%.

Pete:                Right, but Sylvie’s doing great.

Alex:                 She’s doing great.

Pete:                She’s unbelievable, and she’s solving this whole fucking TVA thing.

Alex:                 Have you seen her Instagram? She is living, #living right now. She posted a photo from the void. She looked killer from there.

Pete:                She can look however when she wants it. I think it’s awesome what’s happening, and I would have never known how much I wanted the show until it kind of is. This is so much fun. There’s been so many amazing comics about Loki and so many great character arcs for different characters in this universe, and I would have never known how much fun this Loki story has been. It’s such a cool reward for all the fans and all the Marvel heads.

Alex:                 The other thing that I think is working really nicely about this, and I believe we mentioned this on the podcast before, but we don’t know where this is going. What I mean is in terms of the MCU, we don’t know where this is going because this is relatively uncharted territory. We don’t know what is next for this Loki, where he is headed to versus Wanda Vision, which I loved. We know Wanda is going into Dr. Strange and The Multi-Verse of Madness. You have these connection points there. Captain America and the Winter Soldier, we kind of knew okay, he’s going to head into the cap. That’s going to feed into whatever Avengers’ things happening but everything with the TVA, certainly there’s a lot of speculation about it heading towards Qeng and time and time fracturing and all these things we’re talking about. It could head towards that. It could head directly into Multi-Verse of Madness and no way home.

Pete:                It could hang, and I think this was super clear on the episode so correct me [inaudible 00:13:19], it’s clearly going into a Throg series right after this. [crosstalk 00:13:24]

Alex:                 I would die. I would literally die of happiness.

Pete:                My brain would explode, and I would just be like we did it and just keel over.

Alex:                 Is that a segue to talk through the insane amount Easter eggs of this episode, which you mentioned this at the beginning, but even what I saw Journey Into Mystery and I saw the little description on Disney Plus where it’s Loki meets a bunch of variants of Loki. I was like oh my God, my fingers are going to fall off. There’s no way that I’m going to be able to write all this stuff down, but I tried. I’m sure there’s something we missed, but I’m going to throw stuff out there.

Alex:                 Starting with, we were talking about this before we got on, the title of the episode Journey Into Mystery comes straight from the comic books, comes straight from the introduction of Thor and Loki. They were initially introduced in Journey Into Mystery. Later on, I believe it was a Kieron Gillen run called Journey Into Mystery that focused really heavily on kid Loki versus Ikol who was the classic Loki come back, and that was the villain there. Pretty clear shout-out there.

Alex:                 The other big one, Alioth was a character created by Mark Gruenwald, who we’ve talked about a lot here on the podcast. He was the inspiration, not the inspiration, the creator of the TVA, also a person in the TVA, and Mike Gustovich. They created them for Avengers: The Terminatrix Objective Number One. Probably the important thing here, I kind of want to hold off on Qeng stuff and talk about that at the end. Let’s hold off on speculation about who is the big bad of the series because that’s the big question at the end, but Alioth was a big cloud that looks pretty much like he does on the show that went up directly against Qeng, was summoned by Ravonna Renslayer. There’s all of these connections going on there.

Alex:                 The next one, which I’m sure everybody noticed but is a ludicrous shout-out, is the ThanosCopter, the Thanos helicopter.

Pete:                Yeah, the Thanos Copter.

Alex:                 That was wild. That was the one, the shout-out to me that I was like okay, we’re going for it this episode.

Pete:                Oh yeah we are.

Alex:                 That’s from Spidey Super Stories: Number 39 from March 1979, number 1979. I always call years by their numbers.

Pete:                Sure, sure. Smart, smart.

Alex:                 Absolutely, but that’s a real thing. It was Thanos in a helicopter fighting Hellcat, of all characters, and it later showed up, I believe, in a Deadpool issue, but that was obviously making fun of it. I think, like Thanos, picked up Deadpool there. Then, as you mentioned, we got see frog Thor, AKA Throg, when they zoom through the ground going to the Lokis hideout.

Pete:                We also saw Mjolnir there. We saw the hammer there, just laying there. It’s just so crazy to see in this series all these powerful weapons doing nothing, having no power. It’s very cool.

Alex:                 Yeah. For those who don’t know though, Throg, AKA frog Thor, there’s been a bunch of different identities, but it was Simon Walterson who was a guy, I believe I might have this wrong, but a guy changed into a frog. He actually was not a frog, but he picked up a sliver of Mjolnir, and he was actually introduced very briefly in Thor 364, but on the jar with frog Thor it says T365 because that was the big issue where they really, Thor 365, where they brought him in.

Alex:                 The next one, which is such a deep dive, but in kid Loki’s hideout there were a bunch of different little Easter eggy things. There was Polybius, which is a video game that never existed. It’s an urban legend, and it was supposed to be part of a PSYOPs thing that the government was running that got passed around, I believe in the eighties, but of course never existed. That was the thing that clearly got wiped from the timeline by the TVA. Also, kid Loki was drinking Hi-C Ecto Cooler.

Pete:                Yeah, he was.

Alex:                 Great, great Easter egg, released with Ghostbusters, came out. Legendary. Doesn’t exist anymore. Probably coming out again for the new Ghostbusters movie I’d assume.

Alex:                 We also saw vote Loki. That was a big character, got his head bit off, but he was created by Christopher Hastings for a mini series from 2016 to tie into the election. That was super fun.

Pete:                A Hastings shout-out. That’s awesome.

Alex:                 Yeah, that was great. We’ve had that guy on our live show a bunch of times. He’s a great guy. Great writer. Very fun to see that live on the show.

Pete:                Now this one, I’m just going to throw this out there but I don’t know if this is anything or me just on high alert for Easter eggs, but did you feel like Owen Wilson driving a pizza car was a reference to the Pizza Planet truck from Pixar because he played lightning McQueen from Cars?

Alex:                 Wow. That is a stretch, dude.

Pete:                Probably. Yeah. I just think it’s hysterical that you’re coming to the rescue in this giant pizza cutout cardboard on top of a car. I mean that’s just funny.

Alex:                 I will say there is an actual Easter egg on the car. The license plate is G R N W 1 D, which is Gruenwald, so that’s another Easter egg for Mark Gruenwald. They’ve had a bunch of those in the show, which is very cool.

Alex:                 Next one, this is jumping back to kid Loki’s hideout, but there was Space Mission pinball, which is a pinball game from 1976. Was not imaginary or anything, so I’m not quite sure why it was in there other than it looks cool and that’s it.

Alex:                 Another one, I could not find this on second look, but I swear Dorothy’s house from Wizard of Ox was somewhere in the void. I saw it stuck in the ground at one point, coming out.

Pete:                Whoa.

Alex:                 That seemed probable to me. One that definitely was there, though, the USS Eldridge.

Pete:                Yeah.

Alex:                 Real ship, an actual ship that fought in World War II, but it was part of this whole, again, urban legend thing where people claim that it was turned invisible as part of the Philadelphia Experiment. Obviously it wasn’t, but that’s what they were riffing off of here.

Alex:                 Another one that’s very deep dive and may or may not be accurate, but there’s a marquee, a movie theater marquee that seen in the background at one point, and the title of the movie is Oswald And The Martian. There’s no movie called Oswald And the Martian, but there is a movie, a 1930 animated short called Mars that stars Oswald The Rabbit who was the proto-Mickey Mouse that Walt Disney created. I do think that’s an alternate universe shout-out to there.

Pete:                That is deep, dude.

Alex:                 Very deep, but then there’s a bunch of actual Marvel Universe Easter eggs in there as well. Ronan’s ship from Guardians of the Galaxy of the Dark Aster is crashed there. Also, there’s a helicarrier that’s crashed. You can see that pretty clearly when Alioth attacks. There’s a big, enormous Yellow Jacket helmet, Yellow Jacket being the villain for the first Antman. He disappeared into the quantum realm, so maybe it’s the actual Yellow Jacket and he got his head cut off. I don’t know. Could have happened.

Alex:                 Also, it looks like there’s the head of a living tribunal statue. That’s one of the godlike beans in the Marvel comic book universe that I don’t think has shown up in the MCU yet. Maybe it was in the Guardians of the Galaxy, but I’m not 100% sure.

Alex:                 Also, another little one before I get to the really big one, Roxxiwine, an exceptional pinot noir, that was very fun and tied into the whole rocks cart and rocks on thing that they’ve been running throughout here.

Alex:                 The big one, right at the beginning when they’re zooming through the wrecked New York city, right at the beginning before we check back in with our Loki, we see Stark Tower, but it doesn’t say Stark Tower on it. It says Q E N G, or Qeng, and in the comic books Qeng is a company that takes over Stark Tower and of course it is actually owned not by a guy Qeng, but a guy named Kang who was the time-traveling villain Kang. Let’s talk about this. This was all a long lead up to get into the thing that we need to talk about here, which is at the end of the episode, Sylvie and Loki break open Alioth, come through and they see some sort of building at the end of time. Somebody is there. We don’t know exactly who it is. I’ve seen a speculation online that it was Dr. Doom’s castle, which seems crazy to me. They’re not going to suddenly bring a Dr. Doom for no reason at the end here.

Pete:                I don’t know.

Alex:                 I’ll tell you what and I want to hear your take because I’ve been monologuing for a while here, Pete, but I still feel like the ultimate person beyond the TVA, just given the show, has to be a Loki. I feel like that’s where we have to head towards. That’s the only thing that makes any sort of logical sense to me and plot sense to me, but if Kang is the wizard behind the curtain here, the humbug that is running everything, I’m starting to waiver a little bit on maybe they have set up enough visual cues for that actually to be there. Honestly, the Qeng Tower thing was the thing that started to push me over the edge a little bit.

Pete:                [crosstalk 00:22:32]

Alex:                 What do you think? Who are we heading towards? Who is actually behind the TVA?

Pete:                I think it’s Miss Minutes. I think it’s super clear it’s her running the show. That’s who I feel it is but yeah, I can understand why people want the Kang and are Kang crazy. That would make sense, but it also could be a Loki very easily and with all the Lokis, why wouldn’t it be another Loki. Yeah, yeah, it would be crazy if it was a jet ski, you know what I mean?

Alex:                 Oh, a [inaudible 00:23:10] jet ski or a jet ski Loki?

Pete:                Yeah.

Alex:                 That would be very cool.

Pete:                Awesome, Loki jet ski.

Alex:                 I’ll tell you what, this is very much a side theory but it was a thing that piqued my interest a bit. Miss Minutes, to your point, there could be something going on there potentially, but I was far more interested in what Ravonna was doing and how that tied into what Miss Minute’s doing because after she gives Miss Minutes the assignment to find out everything about the TVA, there’s a smirk that Guga Mbatha-Raw has as she is closing her ten pad that indicated something. She clearly is a huge liar. She’s been lying all the time. She lies to Sylvie in a big way in this episode.

Pete:                Yeah, you think she’s a Loki?

Alex:                 Maybe she’s a Loki. Maybe there’s something else going on.

Pete:                She’s playing, it’s clear in the last episode, she’s playing Owen Wilson. The fact that…If she would have killed the guard, I feel like that would have been like a real key that she’s–

Alex:                 Versus a Loki.

Pete:                That she’s behind things, but I don’t know. There’s so many twists and turns here. It’s awesome to kind of like who, what it’s going to be. This kind of a reveal is really going to be interesting and I’m so happy it wasn’t just three magical lizards.

Alex:                 Yeah.

Pete:                That made me very, very happy in that last episode where we decapitated the evil kind of Disney animatronic kind of thing there.

Alex:                 Yeah, I do, again, we’re going to see it a week. We’re going to find out in a week exactly who is behind this. I do like positioning it as the TVA is kind of the big bad here, which seems pretty obvious, but we didn’t necessarily speculate that way. I think people are looking for a Qeng or a Dr. Doom or some sort of figure that is behind all of this, but ultimately it’s just the bureaucracy of the TVA limiting the timeline and pruning these Loki’s. That is the real problem here. I don’t know. I’ll just very quickly lay out my arguments for both Qeng and a Loki being the person behind the TVA.

Alex:                 The Loki to me makes sense because everything is about Loki. The entire show is about Loki. It’s always Lokis. It’s Lokis all the way down. Like I’ve talked about here before on the podcast, I think if somebody is going to be specifically trying to eliminate Lokis from a timeline, it makes sense to be that it has to be a Loki. That’s sort of the only thing that makes logical sense and certainly to have Loki and Sylvie go up against a Loki at the end makes a lot of sense to me as well.

Alex:                 The Qeng thing, the only reason beyond just the little hints and clues that they put in there with the Qeng Tower, with Alioth, the connection, Ravonna’s connection.

Pete:                We were also talking about time traveling, which is in this wheelhouse.

Alex:                 Yeah, of course, and we talked about this the last episode, but the space lizards look like Qeng. The timekeepers are, they look like that in the comics, but also they’re purple and green just like Qeng. They look like Qeng.

Alex:                 The argument against it is they haven’t said the word Qeng at any point in the show, but the thing that made me sort of wonder a little bit beyond all the stuff in this episode is the fact that they really have introduced a new challenge for Loki and Sylvie, or at least for Loki, in every episode so far. They didn’t mention Alioth before but that was the big cloud that they needed to fight this episode. They could potentially introduce Qeng next episode, and it wouldn’t be exactly out of nowhere and it would still frame that episode as this them versus Qeng. That’s the thing that kind of pushes me there.

Alex:                 I want to throw out what other wild theory to you. What if it’s Freya? What if it is Loki’s mother, because that’s something that we haven’t really dealt with?

Pete:                What?

Alex:                 I know.

Pete:                What?

Alex:                 Yet, in the series, is what if it’s a variant of Freya that is doing something to eliminate Lokis from the timeline or keeping Loki on the right path?

Pete:                That would be just insane. That’s just…I mean…I can’t even.

Alex:                 Well, I’ll throw out two little things that I found out recently that kind of pushed me towards Freya might be important, more important than I think we’re giving credit, though obviously she’s a very important part of the first episode and Loki’s motivation in general, is that I interviewed Natalie Holt, the composer for the show, and she mentioned two things that piqued my interest a little bit. One of them, I asked her about the different themes for Loki and Sylvie and I asked how much Sylvie’s theme fed out of Loki’s theme, and she said, “Well, actually Sylvie’s theme kind of feeds out of Freya’s theme a little bit,” which I thought was kind of weird and interesting and seemed to–

Pete:                You pressed the composer for little nuggets of information.

Alex:                 We were talking about, she brought it up. She mentioned this and I thought that was kind of fascinating. Made me, very briefly in the middle of the night last night when I was just waiting for Loki to be up, it’s made me think what if Sylvie is actually–

Pete:                You woke up in the middle of the night and and you were like it’s Freya. It’s got to be Freya.

Alex:                 I legitimately was staring at the ceiling wondering if Sylvie’s a Freya variant and not a Loki variant at all. That made me very nervous going into this episode that they were going to kiss because gross.

Pete:                Yeah. Loki’s making out with his…Dude, that’s gross.

Alex:                 The other thing that she mentioned, though, was that she composed the theme for episode six first and then worked backwards. She said the reason will become immediately clear why she did that when we see episode six.

Pete:                Oh my god.

Alex:                 Which started to make me think all right, there is going to be some sort of reveal there. There’s going to be some sort of character. How is this going to make sense? I don’t know. I can’t put all the clues together in my head. We’ll see.

Alex:                 Any other moments of the episode?

Pete:                Well, I’m glad this is torturing you a little bit. That makes me happy.

Alex:                 Driving me insane. I’m going crazy.

Pete:                Yeah. All right, yeah, there’s a ton of stuff I wanted to talk about that we haven’t gotten into. Okay. First off, epic opening shot, just epic. A lot of fun tracking shots in this episode, which was great. A lot of cool stuff.

Alex:                 The opening shot was really good. Just that turning around, twisting. It was so uncomfortable to watch.

Pete:                Yeah, it was. It was. It kind of reminded me of, what’s Justin show, Twin Peaks. It kind of was Twin Peaks, butt then I also love when we first meet the other Lokis, the fun just talking. What’s going on with it and they answer it right away because they’re all Lokis. Just so much fun.

Pete:                Yeah. I also really loved his, I thought I would be more weirded out by the Loki alligator. He’s not disheartened by it. That was fun. Then the alligator biting off a Loki arm was just great use of an alligator throughout the whole episode. I really thought the alligator Loki was the real winner after all of this.

Alex:                 Maybe they’ll follow alligator Loki in season two.

Pete:                I hope so.

Alex:                 Alligator the Loki versus…

Pete:                Frog.

Alex:                 Frog Thor. Yes.

Pete:                Yes.

Alex:                 Give the people what they want.

Pete:                Give the people what they want. Then the fun, crazy, just throwaway [inaudible 00:30:47] where it’s like why is this kid the king. Oh, I killed Thor. What?. That was just unbelievable.

Alex:                 Yeah.

Pete:                Yeah. Also like the Miss Universe, or Miss Minutes being stalling.

Alex:                 Listen, she’s a beautiful clock. She could win Miss Universe if she really wanted to.

Pete:                Yeah, there’s no question. Her stalling to trap Sylvie is just, that was so creepy in all the right ways. Yeah, I really love the Loki speech about how Sylvie’s great and he’s changed and we can do this. Then the him and Owen Wilson hug at the end was just so touching.

Alex:                 It really got me.

Pete:                Yeah.

Alex:                 I was so surprised, but I loved that and I loved Mobius saying to Sylvie, “[inaudible 00:31:44] for it?” It was very fun. Very sweet.

Pete:                Just really unbelievable. I couldn’t believe they were running towards each other and they both kind of stopped and it was like oh, hey. I was like, oh my God, this is so awkward. Hug, kiss, do something, but then we got to got that blanket moment which was just awkward in all the right ways. Oh, and then even in the pizza car when they’re running for their lives. Oh, first off, when Sylvie shows up and then you see the pizza car coming to save, that kind of like tension and holy crap moment was just so well done and so believable. Didn’t feel like we were on a sound stage, really felt epic. Then the reveal when she’s like, “You,” and then kind of this talk of like I thought I was on the right side. She’s like, “Oh yeah,” annihilating the whole existences and orphaning children. Classic hero stuff. Oh, just so fun that they got to have that moment in the car. Yeah. Ah, just really sweet and those cute little weird blue birds. I thought they be the key to something. That was very interesting that they kept showing them so much.

Alex:                 Yeah. At first I thought there were peacocks running around, but they were not peacocks.

Pete:                No. No. There were kind of like headless but they had these little balls that we’re kind of like their heads, so it was very interesting, but yeah. Then the classic Loki creating Asgard at the end and going out like a champ with just the fucking, just glorious purpose line. Yeah man, give your life some purpose. This is really moving, powerful stuff and having characters really grasp at what they’re doing and why they’re doing it with this epic backdrop, I’m just having such a blast.

Alex:                 I completely agree with you on Richard E. Grant’s performance, particularly his cackling, his very old school cackling as he goes out, as Alioth takes them down, I thought was wonderful. Something we’ve talked about in the podcast a lot is the possibility of young Avengers coming down the road. It feels like kid Loki still being alive in some form at the end of the episode potentially tees up another member of the young Avengers, or potentially at antagonist for the young Avengers. He killed Thor. He’s a bad ass. We’ll see what happens there.

Pete:                Yeah. I was really impressed with how great all the characters were in their own kind of separate way. Here is kid Loki who killed Thor, but you’re still hey, kid Loki is cool. This is fun.

Alex:                 Yeah. He was great. Jack Veal was real good in the part, and I hope we do get to see him more.

Alex:                 Before we wrap up here, let’s go to the vision board. We certainly talked about a lot of what we think might happen, but what do we want to see in the final episode of the season, Pete?

Pete:                Yeah. I want to see Loki actually back it all up and not betray a Sylvie. I want them to be together as long as it’s not a creepy reveal that they’re related or some kind of creepy. You know what I mean? If we can get that they’re separate things that can have some love is love action, that’d be great.

Alex:                 I want to see my Loki theory come true and there’s going to be a part of me that’s going to be bummed a little bit if it’s Qeng or if it’s somebody else or it’s somebody we haven’t met or heard of in any way before.

Pete:                It has to be because their composer had to do a whole new thing. That just shoots your whole thing right there.

Alex:                 I don’t know, man. I don’t know. That’s what I want to see. That’s on my vision board, all right.

Pete:                I think the composer was playing you. That’s what I think.

Alex:                 Oh, playing me like the instruments she uses to compose things on. Goddamn it, I should’ve seen that. Oh, so frustrating. Thanks Pete. You really opened my eyes to that one.

Alex:                 Folks, if you want to support our podcast, patrion.com/comicbookclub, also we do a live show every Tuesday night at 7:00 PM to Crowdcast and YouTube, come hang out. We would love to speculate about a Loki with you. Itunes, Android, Spotify, Stitcher, or the app of your choice to subscribe and listen to the show at MarvelVision Pond on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook. I was also thinking at the same time, I just wanted to do a little plug. We’re going to have our Black Widow review. It’s going to come out Thursday night timing with the theatrical release in the MarvelVision feed, so check that out. You’re getting two episodes this week. If you listen later on, hundreds of years from now, that timing doesn’t matter to you. Comicbookclublive.com for this podcast and many more. Until next time, stay marvelous.

Pete:                Take care.

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